Joel Dimsdale
History of Brainwashing from Pavlov to Social Media
Aired On: Aug 2, 2024
Show Notes
We know that persuasion techniques occur in advertising but what is the role os soial media in persuasion? What is cuasing the diviseness in s,ociety? Joel Dimsdale, a psychiatrist with extensive experience in these areas, will discuss these issues as well as his two books, Dark Persuasion: A History of Brainwashing from Pavlov to Social Media and Anatomy of Malice: The Enigma of the Nazi War Criminals
Books
Anatomy of Malice: the Enigma of the Nazi War Criminal, 2016
Dark Persuasion: history of brainwashing from Pavlov to social Media 2021
Questions
Why is society so divided?
Are there some who encourage this divisiveness?
Is each side brain washed?
Are techniques used in advertising being applied to social issues?
Mathias Desmet’s book
Satanic mystic ideology puts individuals into isolation unsettled by lack of meaning, free floating anxiety, uneasiness as well as latent frustration, and aggression
This leads to mass formation leading to the emergence of totality state
Harry Bunker Smith’s book
Fear and confusion leads to the control of freedom
Main points
Coercive persuasion is not rare
Set up for coercive persuasion includes sleep deprivation, isolation, stress, group pressure
Peoples of all backgrounds have been targeted
Itsill continue to evele and develop
It will be enhanced by neuroscience development
It will be enhanced in social media
The challenge is to acknowledge that coercive persuasion is real ad think how it influeces our lives and will we be comfortable with it
Education about this is important
He believes the past casts long shadows. It still affects us. It is ongoing
He is interested in how people make awful decisions
He studied the Nuremberg War criminals
He looked at the people who followed the orders and killed people
Brainwashing
A continuum. Education/ persuasion to brain washing continuum
We try to persuade each other all the time.
The crucial issue is the nature of coercion
Ingredients
Imposition of profound stress
Sleep deprivation
Isolation from friends and family alternate messages
Powerful social pressures towards conformity
Is a powerful force
This has gone on a long time
The Inquisition forced people to confess
Isolate, sleep deprive, stress
New in current times is the addition of the scientific method
Pavlov
When a flood in St Petersburg, affected his dogs. The dogs were rescued via putting them in the water
The dogs were never the same: they forgot all the conditioning and learning that Pavlov taught them
The dogs’ personalities changed
Pavlov was concerned about the affect of stress on humans
Lenin asked if Pavlov could make the people be good Communists
He brought a scientific method to this issue
In WW II folks were interested in drugs to compel truth telling
People were also interested in drugs that could relax people so that memories could come forth
Amatol interviews
Truth serums originated in obstetrics in Texas with “twilight drugs given to birthing mothers
The Cold War was concerned with conversion of the enemy
In Korea, the Chines, Russians, and North Koreans worked on getting prisoners to defect. Some American boys did.
China employed group pressure systems
Get people to admit whether they were children of privilege
This is where the term brainwashing comes from.
Academics became involved in the 40 s and 50s
MK Ultra in the US
Funding vehicle through which the CIA could funnel funds to academics to compel behavior. (The Manhattan Project of the mind)
Studies
Barbiturates and sedatives could help people suffering from mental illness
The culmination of MK Ultra occurred in McGill Montreal (Dr Cameron)
Their view was to treat mental illness, memories had to be obliterated and start all over
Cf. Jason Borne books /movies
They did massive electro convulsion therapy and psychedelics such as mescalin
He shocked patients, keeping them comatose while giving them messages through a helmet up to 250,000 times
His scientific methods were poor
He was good at obliterating memories but he could not get people to change their minds
Non chemical approaches to coercive persuasion
Stockholm Syndrome bank tellers were locked in in the vault for a couple of days. The hostages became fond of the robbers and distrusted the police. The hostages blew kisses at the robbers upon rescue
Hobis Data Base (hostage and barricade situation data base established by FBI)
Sympathy with kidnappers is common particularly in children and people not exposed to the world
Use of social pressure
Advertising how we dress, behave.
E.g. turn around and face the back of the elevator. We are persuaded to follow what is “right” behavior
With repetitive stimuli, beliefs can be shaped
Sleep deprived are more amenable to persuasion as their judgment is impaired.
Partial sleep deprivation is effective
With four hours sleep, people think they are sharper than they are
Social Media
Is an intoxicant
If young and socially isolated, working long hours on computer
Are sleep deprived, isolated, getting information
When bullied have core ingredients for coercive persuasion.
Robert Lustig’s work states social media is addictive with intermittent reinforcement triggering dopamine
They titrate the “likes” to increase use
At play are individual rights, freedom of speech, belief is truth are in conflict
He is concerned about disinformation that hurts people
A Rand report commented a squirt gun of truth can triumph over a fire hose of deception
The question is what is malicious